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Help with Paypal claim!!!

post #1 of 41
Thread Starter 
recently i sold my zathans 784 on ebay the ones i have in the mall:

http://www.honestforum.com/mens-30-3...eap-trade.html

the seller emailed me requesting more pictures and i gave it to him but i dont have that email anymore to proove it..anywayhere is the link of the ebay auction im talking about:

Diesel zathan jeans 784 32 !!100% ORIGININAL!!772zatiny - eBay (item 160307931070 end time Jan-10-09 05:37:44 PST)

i wrote everything in the description!

the seller opened a dispute claiming this:

The article is very corrupt and does not correspond to the description. The exterior is damaged, torn and Befleckt at the end of leg missing nearly half the hems. this is not the truth that they had sent me pictures

the additinoal pictures i emailed him were thisif i remember correctly(but like i said i dont have that email saved!!):

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w...n/Slika061.jpg

it was this or either this one

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w...n/Slika016.jpg

but both clearly show the condition and what you get if you buy the jeans!!

i will post this url of the thread on paypal dispute and would like all of your opininion..

and for the end ..here's my latest response to the buyer claiming he has not saved emails with me sending him pictures and him requesting for it and that i never send him pictures in the first place:

ALSO if youre claiming i didint send you the pictures then why actually did you buy the jeans??if its written in description that back of legs are frayed you should have asked for pictures right(and you did) but now youre claiming i didint send them to you...well if i didint send them to you,then why did you bid if you didint have pictures!!!it doesnt make sense and its obivous that youre a liar!

when i send him pictures i also clearly mentioned those dirt at the bottom o back hems is only dirt and will go off if he puts water on it..the back of hems are frayed like 1 inch max whihc is clearly seen from the photos
post #2 of 41
Sorry, you're gonna lose dude. Those pictures needed to be in the AUCTION's description. You could have promised him the world outside of eBay, that won't count for the dispute.


Those are way more than "little frayed" That's way way past fraying, that left the realm of 'fray' ages ago. Those hems are fucked.
post #3 of 41
I agree. Those hems were ripped the shred. Unless you disclose everything in the auction your pretty much short. Save yourself some time and just refund the buyer, after he sends them back that is. Re-list and this time cover your back.
post #4 of 41
Thread Starter 
the world aint fair..theres so many auctions without pictures thats why i said it n description the hems are frayed and i can give buyers additional pictures if they request it..he did and i gave it to him,if he claims i never send them then why did he bid,unless he aleady knew the back of hems were destroyed(because it says in descripiton) and he obivously knows that if you dont post picture of the heM in the auction he can claim on paypal and will win, HE KNEW ALRIGHT THAT THE HEMS WERE DESTROYED BUT HE TOOK THIS IN ADVANTAGE AS HE ALSO KNEW HE WILL GE THE MONEY BACK,ALL PART OF HIS PLAN..he tought this all the way through..SCAMMER
post #5 of 41
Thread Starter 
i highly doubt that he would be willing to return these ,if youre smart by reading all this it can be clearly seen he wants to wear them,but wants to get money back for them..
post #6 of 41
Thread Starter 
i hate paypal and i hate ebay,so far i sold two zathans both for 60 euros and every time buyer complained either he didint receive and now this..all because im from some unknwon country they think they can scamm me..i lost jeans plus money all beacuse of the stupid system
post #7 of 41
You have to be very careful on ebay and paypal, winning a dispute with paypal is very easy for the buyer, it's a shitty system but you have to put EVERYTHING in the auction to be covered in case of dispute...you can say what you want, he will win...

I think you can ask the guy to send you the pants first before refunding him...
post #8 of 41
Thread Starter 
i have offered him to return this now and ill refund him,but i doubt he will whihc just prooves even more that hes a thief and a liar..even if he refuses to return them paypal still wont see what the real background is and ill loose everything
post #9 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by jakolin View Post
the world aint fair..theres so many auctions without pictures thats why i said it n description the hems are frayed and i can give buyers additional pictures if they request it..he did and i gave it to him,if he claims i never send them then why did he bid,unless he aleady knew the back of hems were destroyed(because it says in descripiton) and he obivously knows that if you dont post picture of the heM in the auction he can claim on paypal and will win, HE KNEW ALRIGHT THAT THE HEMS WERE DESTROYED BUT HE TOOK THIS IN ADVANTAGE AS HE ALSO KNEW HE WILL GE THE MONEY BACK,ALL PART OF HIS PLAN..he tought this all the way through..SCAMMER

You've got the first sentence right: The world is not fair. Yes, so many auctions without pictures, but who is to say that they don't end in this way. Once someone launched a Paypal claim against me and my pictures were big, clear and detailed with a very detailed descrption to match and the pictures included all possible angles and he claimed the item was not as described so there is NO WAY in hell you can win this dispute my friend. Just offer to refund and get it over with. It's not worth even beginning to try and fight this one.


You did not say that the hems were 'destroyed'. You said that the jeans are in perfect condition and that the leg openings were a little frayed. That is very misleading given the pictures that you have provided.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jakolin View Post
i highly doubt that he would be willing to return these ,if youre smart by reading all this it can be clearly seen he wants to wear them,but wants to get money back for them..
Wait... what? So you are trying to say that me and the other persons that have commented in this thread that you will lose the auction and that it is your fault are stupid? You wrote a very misleading auction description. NO WAY even taking into account your additional pictures, are these Zathans in perfect condition. If he doesn't return the jeans, then you win, end of story. But I am thinking that he will because he was probably genuinely surprised by the jeans when he opened the package.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jakolin View Post
i hate paypal and i hate ebay,so far i sold two zathans both for 60 euros and every time buyer complained either he didint receive and now this..all because im from some unknwon country they think they can scamm me..i lost jeans plus money all beacuse of the stupid system

You should have learned from your previous lessons and included more pictures or don't use eBay anymore. You can use photobucket, Imageshack and many other Free image hosting services to add lots of pictures without paying a cent.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jakolin View Post
i have offered him to return this now and ill refund him,but i doubt he will whihc just prooves even more that hes a thief and a liar..even if he refuses to return them paypal still wont see what the real background is and ill loose everything

It's good that you have offered to return... it's the best thing to do. Please please please learn your lesson from this. Include shots of back and front of your jeans, not just a pocket and a crop of another part of the jeans.
post #10 of 41
Thread Starter 
"Wait... what? So you are trying to say that me and the other persons that have commented in this thread that you will lose the auction and that it is your fault are stupid?


im not sure what you were trying to say,but i dnt think you who comment on this are stupid,just that by reading the facts this buyer knew how the procedure with paypal runs,and as he got the pictures through email(whihc he claims he didnt) he knew what kind of jeans he is going to get!but he also knew he could just open a dispute because the pictures of the hem were not in the description and that he could claim easily i didint send him extra pics..he knew from begining he will do this when he gets the jeans,thats what im trying to say..so i doubt he would want to return the jeans..anyway i offered to him to return them,we will see what happens...BUT WHAT IF HE SAYS HE WILL RETURN THEM AND I NEVER GET THEM WHIHC MEANS HE JUST CLAIMS TO HAVE SEND THEM BUT HE DIDNT??WHAT HAPPENS THEN,im quite sure he iss capable of doing this kind of bullshit as well
post #11 of 41
He has to provide tracking, and you have to acknowledge that you received the jeans back in order for the refund to be processed. You don't refund UNTIL you get the jeans back, simple as that.
post #12 of 41
just wondering, how those code name "Stalingrad To Berlin", wash WW2 jeans fall under "perfect condition" description in your auction.
post #13 of 41
I know if I opened a package expecting 'perfect condition' jeans, my nerves would be more than 'a little frayed'.
post #14 of 41
that auction is extremely misleading
post #15 of 41
I think you wanted to deceive the buyer man, clearly you didnt post the pics that show the overall condition(POOR) of the pants. You will lose nad deserve to lose.
You should get your jeans back of course. Paypal tracks the return if im not mistalken so youre covered in that department.
post #16 of 41
Thread Starter 
youre right i didint want to put pictures of the hem directly on the auction,i feel sorry now that i didint put a photobucket link,but i tought if people wanted to see how the back hems look like they will email me for more pictures(like this one did,but hes lying he didint receive the photos)..i didint know im not covered under paypal,if i knew that id put the links already in the auction..i tough if i write in description that the hems are destryoed it will be enough and that its upon buyer to request for more pictures if he is concerned about that..true is also that by little frayyed some and lots might think its almost like new..while the one hem is actually just destryoed but the fraying doesnt go into depth while on the other there is an inch or sort of fraying,besides that theyre in perfect condition as far as concerns me..now i now next time to put photos and everything in the description...im sure buyer wil also then somehow through other way around try to get money back,surely hell think of something,we all know that sellers from countries such as mine are not trusthworthy and such thats why people like this buyer of mine try to take advantage...

I WOULD ABSOLUTELY AGREE WITH ALL OF YOU SAYING YOU'D BE SURPRISED AND PISSED TO GET JEANS WITH DESTROYED BACK HEMS,THE PROBLEM HERE IS THAT THIS GUY RECEIVED THE PICTURES AND KNEW WELL ENOUGH WHAT HES GETTING,OBVIOUSLY NOONE OF YOU GET WHAT IM TRYING TO SAY TO YOU..I WOULD ALSO UDNERSTAND IF HE DIDINT ASK FOR PICS BUT JUST RELY ON MY DESCRIPTION WERE I SAID LITTLE FRAYED..THEN I WOULD UNDERSTAND HIS COMLPLAINT BUT LIKE IM SAYING HE GOT THE PICTURES ALRIGHT,THEREFORE HE IS A SCAMMER
post #17 of 41
- you never said 'destroyed' in the auction, that (MAYYYYYYYYYYY have helped if you said 'destroyed' instead of 'perfect condition', you but your lack of pictures in the auction spelled your doom

- The word fray according to Merriam-Webster...

1 a: to wear (as an edge of cloth) by or as if by rubbing : fret b: to separate the threads at the edge of
2. to wear out or into shreds

If you had said, ripped, torn, etc. That would have been much much better for you.


- IF you know that sellers from your country are known scammers, you should have done more to protect yourself.


And this my friends is the lesson we must take away from this thread. Cover your ass always.
post #18 of 41
from a purely paypal perspective...
if he is just debating the quality of what you sent him
you should win the claim...


ive had about 50 claims on paypal for many different things...
the ONLY time ive ever lost is if i dont have tracking and they claim they have not received....(especially over seas)

everytime ive had a claim for better description i always win just because paypal says "They do not debate quality of merchandise"....
post #19 of 41
Thread Starter 
so youre saying i should go until the end with the dispute and stick with my opiion?
but if in some case paypal decides for him to be refunded i dont get my jeans back..in this its still safer for me to ask him now to return these and at least get my jeans then to risk and loose the dispute plus loose the jeans...
post #20 of 41
Paypal will see that you get your jeans back, after that the buyer will get refunded, i tell you this because i won a claim against a seller that sent me a pair of Wrangler jeans instead of Zathan 71J. I had to send the jeans with tracking.
post #21 of 41
I'm wondering, how da hell exactly does paypal know if someone has actually sent or returned the actual item that they claimed to paypal they have?
post #22 of 41
i see some people say paypal use tracking to track but having mailed something with a tracking number doesn't mean the actual item has been mailed, am i wrong?
post #23 of 41
if you want to protect yourself as a buyer, get a real merchant account for processing credit cards online- they link right into ebay checkouts and you get charged less on the processing and have more security as a seller. Just go to proposalportal.com and fill out a credit card processing quote request and 5 companies will compete for you lendingtree style-
post #24 of 41
Paypal requests you as the returner of the item to provide the tracking number on the dispute console....they track it themselves i dont know how they knew the package i sent for refund arrived to the scammer before i did!!!
post #25 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by jakolin View Post
so youre saying i should go until the end with the dispute and stick with my opiion?
but if in some case paypal decides for him to be refunded i dont get my jeans back..in this its still safer for me to ask him now to return these and at least get my jeans then to risk and loose the dispute plus loose the jeans...


yes if you think you are in the right...

worst thing that could happen is paypal deceides in his favor and he has to send you the jeans back before he gets your $$$
which imo WILL NOT happen.
however this will cost you a bad feedback probably... but worth the $$ im sure...
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