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HF Decides 2008. Who will U vote for? - Page 8

Poll Results: Who will you vote for?

 
  • 22% (35)
    McCain / Palin
  • 56% (86)
    Obama / Biden
  • 3% (5)
    other
  • 5% (8)
    undecided
  • 12% (19)
    I can't vote (too young or not US citizen)
153 Total Votes  
post #176 of 337
reading anton's posts makes me happy he/she is not in any real position of power.

how old are you?
post #177 of 337
Quote:
Originally Posted by fncestudent View Post
how old are you?
19, but since this is the internet I like to assume that nobody here knows me or anything about me in person/reality, thus I believe that what I say in my posts in no way can result in any consequences or harm to me personally and/or physically.

Basically, I don't know you and you don't know me. I just take advantage of that in order to express strong views, often morally wrong, on serious subjects.

post #178 of 337
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anton View Post
19, but since this is the internet I like to assume that nobody here knows me or anything about me in person/reality, thus I believe that what I say in my posts in no way can result in any consequences or harm to me personally and/or physically.

Basically, I don't know you and you don't know me. I just take advantage of that in order to express strong views, often morally wrong, on serious subjects.

So are you basically saying your too much of a pussy to express your stong views in someones face?

Sometimes all one can do is laugh.
post #179 of 337
I was just wondering what you guys thought about Jesse Ventura? If you want to personally comment on him go ahead, but yall could just use the -/+
post #180 of 337
Quote:
Originally Posted by LinuxChild View Post
I was just wondering what you guys thought about Jesse Ventura? If you want to personally comment on him go ahead, but yall could just use the -/+
He seems pretty open-minded and quite outspoken. I especially like what he said about "Equal opportunity for women"

Quote:
[...]But I hear an awful lot of women arguing for equal treatment, but then the minute the going gets tough, they start hollering about harassment and abuse. We seem to have gotten so overly sensitive about harassment that it makes it look like women can’t handle any kind of sexual overtures from men at all. I think we need to get a whole lot clearer on what we mean by harassment and assault, because right now the definition is arbitrary.

[Source]
post #181 of 337
ventura is a nut job , that consipracy 9/11 talk is the stuff of fantasy. I wish he was not associated in anyway with Ron Paul , who I like .


anton is a child, and from his immaturity seems much younger then his 19 years.


and there are many reasons i will not vote for obama, and I assure his color is not one of them

I am offended by your ridiculous statements of the south, you have no idea of what you speak other then some judgmental opinion that you have.. thats not to say that racists don't exist in the south or everywhere for that matter but they are most def not the majority..


anton just so you can learn a thing or two here is the reason I am not voting for obama

Will institute a socialized national health care plan
McCain: No
Obama: Yes



Would pull troops out of Iraq immediately
McCain: No
Obama: Yes


Proposed programs will mean a huge tax increase

McCain: No
Obama: Yes



Voted against making English the official language

McCain :No

Obama: Yes

Voted to give Social Security benefits to illegals

McCain: No

Obama: Yes



CAPITAL GAINS TAX


MC CAIN

0% on home sales up to $500,000 per home (couples). Mc Cain does not propose any change in existing home sales income tax.

OBAMA

28% on profit from ALL home sales. (How does this affect you? If you sell your home and make a profit, you will pay 28% of your gain on taxes. If you are heading toward retirement and would like to down-size your home or move into a retirement community, 28% of the money you make from your home will go to taxes. This proposal will adversely affect the elderly who are counting on the income from their homes as part of their retirement income.)



DIVIDEND TAX


MC CAIN

15% (no change)

OBAMA

39.6% - (How will this affect you? If you have any money invested in stock market, IRA, mutual funds, college funds, life insurance, retirement accounts, or anything that pays or reinvests dividends, you will now be paying nearly 40% of the money earned on taxes if Obama becomes president. The experts predict that 'Higher tax rates on dividends and capital gains would crash the stock market, yet do absolutely nothing to cut the deficit.')



INCOME TAX


MC CAIN
(no changes)

Single making 30K - tax $4,500
Single making 50K - tax $12,500
Single making 75K - tax $18,750
Married making 60K- tax $9,000
Married making 75K - tax $18,750
Married making 125K - tax $31,250

OBAMA (reversion to pre-Bush tax cuts)

Single making 30K - tax $8,400
Single making 50K - tax $14,000
Single making 75K - tax $23,250
Married making 60K - tax $16,800
Married making 75K - tax $21,000
Married making 125K - tax $38,750
Under Obama, your taxes could almost double!



INHERITANCE TAX


MC CAIN

- 0% (No change, Bush repealed this tax)

OBAMA

Restore the inheritance tax
Many families have lost businesses, farms, ranches, and homes that have been in their families for generations because they could not afford the inheritance tax. Those willing their assets to loved ones will only lose them to these taxes.



NEW TAXES PROPOSED BY OBAMA


New government taxes proposed on homes that are more than 2400 square feet. New gasoline taxes (as if gas weren't high enough already) New taxes on natural resources consumption (heating gas, water, electricity) New taxes on retirement accounts, and last but not least....New taxes to pay for socialized medicine so we can receive the same level of medical care as other third-world countries!!!
post #182 of 337
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernBellefromSC View Post
anton just so you can learn a thing or two here is the reason I am not voting for obama
That's not a reason, that's a cut-n-paste.
post #183 of 337
true but they are my reasons.. i am sitting here watching a football game and googled a few sites to find the most comprehensive list I could find.. and since I dont agree with McCain on everything I had to cut and paste ...
post #184 of 337
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernBellefromSC View Post
true but they are my reasons.. i am sitting here watching a football game and googled a few sites to find the most comprehensive list I could find.. and since I dont agree with McCain on everything I had to cut and paste ...
Ok.
post #185 of 337
Wow! America is being brain wash by Osama! OBAMA=
Wake up America!!
I would rather vote for Gary Colman...LOL!!
post #186 of 337
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhaven View Post
Wow! America is being brain wash by Osama! OBAMA=
Wake up America!!
I would rather vote for Gary Colman...LOL!!
Ah come on, anybody would vote for Gary Coleman, he wins by default!
post #187 of 337
hahah... obama is not going to pull the troops out of Iraq immediately- the ONLY one who said he would do that is Ron Paul!
post #188 of 337
I can copy and paste too.

I also included the source, which I think is the responsible thing to do when quoting things.

Not sure who does fact-checking for the GOP, because either they're not doing their job, or they don't mind distorting the truth.

Quote:

Attacks, praise stretch truth at GOP convention
By JIM KUHNHENN, Associated Press Writer
Wed Sep 3, 11:48 PM ET

Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin and her Republican supporters held back little Wednesday as they issued dismissive attacks on Barack Obama and flattering praise on her credentials to be vice president. In some cases, the reproach and the praise stretched the truth.

Some examples:

PALIN: "I have protected the taxpayers by vetoing wasteful spending ... and championed reform to end the abuses of earmark spending by Congress. I told the Congress 'thanks but no thanks' for that Bridge to Nowhere."

THE FACTS: As mayor of Wasilla, Palin hired a lobbyist and traveled to Washington annually to support earmarks for the town totaling $27 million. In her two years as governor, Alaska has requested nearly $750 million in special federal spending, by far the largest per-capita request in the nation. While Palin notes she rejected plans to build a $398 million bridge from Ketchikan to an island with 50 residents and an airport, that opposition came only after the plan was ridiculed nationally as a "bridge to nowhere."

PALIN: "There is much to like and admire about our opponent. But listening to him speak, it's easy to forget that this is a man who has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform — not even in the state senate."

THE FACTS: Compared to McCain and his two decades in the Senate, Obama does have a more meager record. But he has worked with Republicans to pass legislation that expanded efforts to intercept illegal shipments of weapons of mass destruction and to help destroy conventional weapons stockpiles. The legislation became law last year. To demean that accomplishment would be to also demean the work of Republican Sen. Richard Lugar of Indiana, a respected foreign policy voice in the Senate. In Illinois, he was the leader on two big, contentious measures in Illinois: studying racial profiling by police and requiring recordings of interrogations in potential death penalty cases. He also successfully co-sponsored major ethics reform legislation.

PALIN: "The Democratic nominee for president supports plans to raise income taxes, raise payroll taxes, raise investment income taxes, raise the death tax, raise business taxes, and increase the tax burden on the American people by hundreds of billions of dollars."

THE FACTS: The Tax Policy Center, a think tank run jointly by the Brookings Institution and the Urban Institute, concluded that Obama's plan would increase after-tax income for middle-income taxpayers by about 5 percent by 2012, or nearly $2,200 annually. McCain's plan, which cuts taxes across all income levels, would raise after tax-income for middle-income taxpayers by 3 percent, the center concluded.

Obama would provide $80 billion in tax breaks, mainly for poor workers and the elderly, including tripling the Earned Income Tax Credit for minimum-wage workers and higher credits for larger families.

He also would raise income taxes, capital gains and dividend taxes on the wealthiest. He would raise payroll taxes on taxpayers with incomes above $250,000, and he would raise corporate taxes. Small businesses that make more than $250,000 a year would see taxes rise.

MCCAIN: "She's been governor of our largest state, in charge of 20 percent of America's energy supply ... She's responsible for 20 percent of the nation's energy supply. I'm entertained by the comparison and I hope we can keep making that comparison that running a political campaign is somehow comparable to being the executive of the largest state in America," he said in an interview with ABC News' Charles Gibson.

THE FACTS: McCain's phrasing exaggerates both claims. Palin is governor of a state that ranks second nationally in crude oil production, but she's no more "responsible" for that resource than President Bush was when he was governor of Texas, another oil-producing state. In fact, her primary power is the ability to tax oil, which she did in concert with the Alaska Legislature. And where Alaska is the largest state in America, McCain could as easily have called it the 47th largest state — by population.

MCCAIN: "She's the commander of the Alaska National Guard. ... She has been in charge, and she has had national security as one of her primary responsibilities," he said on ABC.

THE FACTS: While governors are in charge of their state guard units, that authority ends whenever those units are called to actual military service. When guard units are deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan, for example, they assume those duties under "federal status," which means they report to the Defense Department, not their governors. Alaska's national guard units have a total of about 4,200 personnel, among the smallest of state guard organizations.

FORMER ARKANSAS GOV. MIKE HUCKABEE: Palin "got more votes running for mayor of Wasilla, Alaska than Joe Biden got running for president of the United States."

THE FACTS: A whopper. Palin got 616 votes in the 1996 mayor's election, and got 909 in her 1999 re-election race, for a total of 1,525. Biden dropped out of the race after the Iowa caucuses, but he still got 76,165 votes in 23 states and the District of Columbia where he was on the ballot during the 2008 presidential primaries.

FORMER MASSACHUSETTS GOV. MITT ROMNEY: "We need change, all right — change from a liberal Washington to a conservative Washington! We have a prescription for every American who wants change in Washington — throw out the big-government liberals, and elect John McCain and Sarah Palin."

THE FACTS: A Back-to-the-Future moment. George W. Bush, a conservative Republican, has been president for nearly eight years. And until last year, Republicans controlled Congress. Only since January 2007 have Democrats have been in charge of the House and Senate.

___ Associated Press Writer Jim Drinkard in Washington contributed to this report.
post #189 of 337
The GOP is very smart when it comes to their spin. ri0tp00f, although what you posted is valid, those who were dazzled while watching the speeches at the convention will not see the truth. First impressions are the most lasting, especially since the whole public was waiting to eat up any little tidbit about the unknown governor.

The RNC strategists made a brilliant move by deciding to "stretch the truth" during a hotly anticipated introductory campaign speech--nobody could attack or refute--the facts are made plain later. It's too late, as those who were unconvinced became convinced and those who were undecided, finally decided. Palin is so popular now.

So now, the only people willing to scrutinize the facts and take them into consideration are the opponents. I'm Independent, btw.
post #190 of 337
^ I still REALLY don't see how Palin can be popular. REALLY.
post #191 of 337
You can list all of McCains' and Obamas' positions on all the issues. They will eventually waffle on most of them and will have trouble implenting many of them.
There is, however, one cut and dry, absolute deal breaker for me. I could never vote for anyone who isn't pro choice
post #192 of 337
DIVIDEND TAX


MC CAIN

15% (no change)

OBAMA

39.6% - (How will this affect you? If you have any money invested in stock market, IRA, mutual funds, college funds, life insurance, retirement accounts, or anything that pays or reinvests dividends, you will now be paying nearly 40% of the money earned on taxes if Obama becomes president. The experts predict that 'Higher tax rates on dividends and capital gains would crash the stock market, yet do absolutely nothing to cut the deficit.')


This actually made me laugh. It makes me realize how much politics really is about just lying to the misinformed. Dividend taxes come only in non-retirement accounts. IRAs and college funds are not taxed for gains ever. You are subject to early withdrawal penalties (before 59 1/2) in an IRA as well as your normal income tax bracket. college funds grow tax-deferred provided their withdrawals are used for higher education purposes. Obviously, the govt won't know what you spend that college account money on, but if you're audited, you have to prove it was a "qualified distribution"

The "fact" they used is completely untrue, infact it's a bold faced lie. It truly makes me question the validity of everything else you posted from that site. I'm not saying i'm questioning you Southern, just the site that it was pulled from.

and to be on topic....i'm still undecided. I know most all candidates will lie about something, and more than likely my decision will come down to who I think will lie to me the least.
post #193 of 337
^ Yeah, I would like to know JD's source(s) for what she posted.

I think it's irresponsible to spread things like that without listing sources.
post #194 of 337
sorry spence you are correct I should have listed the cut and paste sources... I was just in a hurry watching the game..

here are some of the sources that contain the information from my copy and paste job:


Election 2008: The candidates and your money - CNNMoney

Taxes: Election Center 2008 - CNN.com


Analysis - health08.org

Compare Candidates on Health Insurance
post #195 of 337
I don't see the majority of the information you posted in any of those links. Specifically the "how does this affect you" parts.

The income tax part in particular seems particularly inaccurate, since it's well-known that Obama plans for tax relief to the lowest earners, not to increase their taxes. What you listed shows the lowest earners having the highest % change, which is completely inaccurate. The fact is, the majority of Americans will pay less in income tax.

How McCain and Obama will change your tax bill - Jun. 11, 2008
post #196 of 337
Quote:
Originally Posted by sonicvoodoo View Post
You can list all of McCains' and Obamas' positions on all the issues. They will eventually waffle on most of them and will have trouble implenting many of them.
There is, however, one cut and dry, absolute deal breaker for me. I could never vote for anyone who isn't pro choice
plus fucking one

Quote:
Originally Posted by maddiconner View Post
^ I still REALLY don't see how Palin can be popular. REALLY.
there are some insane religious nutbags out there?
post #197 of 337
^ you mean Sevenkid and Infinite? LOL
post #198 of 337
I fall into a high income tax bracket.. and as such I will pay more under obama

also his plan does indeed reduce taxes for the lower and middle class but hits the "super rich" in a huge way

I am not super rich.. but I know people that are.. I don't think government has the right to take that much more of their money, because they are rich. The amount that Obama is going after is in some attempt to "leveling the playing field".

I don't support that kind of piracy at all, I dont want Robin hood for a president
post #199 of 337
"Until men learn that of all human symbols, Robin Hood is the most immoral and the most contemptible, there will be no justice on earth and no way for mankind to survive."

post #200 of 337
OK Ms. Rand
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