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post #26 of 147
6/16/08 at 7:45pm
I heard you guys got "The right to bare arms" mixed up with "The right to bear arms" a loooong time ago...
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post #27 of 147
6/16/08 at 8:50pm
for all your gun toting needs!

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post #28 of 147
6/17/08 at 3:40am
I can understand why people want to be able to defend themselves when stuff like this happens. To me the bigger problem is why do things like this happen; could it have been prevented? Playing the blame game is dumb too, but when human-caused tragedies go down we need to think more proactively, not reactively aka shoot someone. My mom worked in the mental health system for over 30 years and has seen how, budget and space issues have caused as much care as possible to be done on an outpatient basis when many of these people would have been treated as inpatients years ago (and really should still be), point being there are some people in the general public who have mental illnesses that can put themselves and others in danger. -- not to say that this was the case here, but that this reality exists

I talked with a local police officer a while back about guns and he told me what happens (from his experience) is a victim pulls out a gun and then has it taken away from then, further arming the attacker. Some would say they didn't know how to use the gun properly, have enough practice etc. But to me this just further feeds into an unhealthy fear in society.
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post #29 of 147
6/17/08 at 4:43am
Agree with you MatthewK
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post #30 of 147
6/17/08 at 6:36am
Quote:
but when human-caused tragedies go down we need to think more proactively, not reactively aka shoot someone.
Thats easy for you to say.
Ask the girl who was raped and tortured for 19 hours. She might have a different opinion.
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post #31 of 147
6/17/08 at 6:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MatthewK View Post
I can understand why people want to be able to defend themselves when stuff like this happens. To me the bigger problem is why do things like this happen; could it have been prevented? Playing the blame game is dumb too, but when human-caused tragedies go down we need to think more proactively, not reactively aka shoot someone. My mom worked in the mental health system for over 30 years and has seen how, budget and space issues have caused as much care as possible to be done on an outpatient basis when many of these people would have been treated as inpatients years ago (and really should still be), point being there are some people in the general public who have mental illnesses that can put themselves and others in danger. -- not to say that this was the case here, but that this reality exists

I talked with a local police officer a while back about guns and he told me what happens (from his experience) is a victim pulls out a gun and then has it taken away from then, further arming the attacker. Some would say they didn't know how to use the gun properly, have enough practice etc. But to me this just further feeds into an unhealthy fear in society.
I wanted to write something along these lines yesterday but was too tired. Don't get me wrong; I'm not completely against guns, but I don't see how one would have helped this woman when she couldn't even reach for the phone in her bag...
And preventing these tragedies is important. This country has a huge problem of child abuse and neglect, which is growing bigger and bigger every year. I'm not saying all abused/neglected children turn into crazy criminals... but I'm sure some do, poor little things.
I don't have much time to write on this forum, so I'm sorry my posts are somewhat superficial as I would like to write more about this issue.

edit: the reason why I don't have more time? baby sitting on my lap wanting to type away herself. who knows? it might be more interesting....
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post #32 of 147
6/17/08 at 9:22am
^ If we had the right to carry arms it would have gone down like this... " OH I think that guy from the elevator is following me because I can hear the wheels of his suitcase squeaking down the hall right behind me. Holy shit, what do I do? Oh yes, that's right, I have a gun in my purse. Let me turn around and point it at him and tell him to move along I am calling the police on the cell phone I already have right in my hand, while I knock on every door down the hall."

Unfortunately her gut instinct was too late. It just goes to show you that trusting your gut can most likely save your life. When you feel the hairs on the back of your neck standing at attention, or that queasy feeling in the pit of your stomach, something is wrong, out of place, that's about your only warning. Screw political correctness, go ahead and hurt someones feeling because you are scared of them, apologize later.

Personally I think jail and my tax dollars supporting his crazy ass is FAR too good for this man. Unless Bubba is in the cell next to him, then I might consider sending him some really slippery soap.
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post #33 of 147
6/17/08 at 11:17am
^ you're right about trusting your gut feeling and that it's better being rude than sorry.... as far as the '"gun situation" is concerned, I don't think it's the only answer because it might work for a single girl without kids, but it would never work for me. I'd have to stash that gun so far from where my kid could possibly get it (unloaded, of course) where it wouldn't do me any good in a situation like this.
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post #34 of 147
6/17/08 at 12:22pm
This news story was from June 6th, does anyone know what happened to this guy? He needs to go to prison and be put in whatever section of the prison likes to kills people like him. The fact that anyone would want to do this to another human being for no apparent reason makes this about the worst thing I can even imagine. I can only imagine how messed up this poor girl must be.
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post #35 of 147
6/17/08 at 12:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by poorPOOHbaby View Post
^ If we had the right to carry arms it would have gone down like this... " OH I think that guy from the elevator is following me because I can hear the wheels of his suitcase squeaking down the hall right behind me. Holy shit, what do I do? Oh yes, that's right, I have a gun in my purse. Let me turn around and point it at him and tell him to move along I am calling the police on the cell phone I already have right in my hand, while I knock on every door down the hall."

Unfortunately her gut instinct was too late. It just goes to show you that trusting your gut can most likely save your life. When you feel the hairs on the back of your neck standing at attention, or that queasy feeling in the pit of your stomach, something is wrong, out of place, that's about your only warning. Screw political correctness, go ahead and hurt someones feeling because you are scared of them, apologize later.

Personally I think jail and my tax dollars supporting his crazy ass is FAR too good for this man. Unless Bubba is in the cell next to him, then I might consider sending him some really slippery soap.
Do you realize how many times a gun would be pulled on someone because some one thought they were being followed if everyone was allowed to have guns? I don't know if you're in college but this would scare the fuck out of me -- if I'm walking home from a party and some girl in front of me is drunk OR sober at night and decides to pull a gun on me I would freak.

Yes, what happened to her was bad. But come on, like said above, if she couldn't reach for her phone. She wouldn't be able to reach for her gun. And I'm going to get hella negged for this -- but I'd rather have one poor victim raped for 19 hours versus random people walking around me with guns in their bag that can be pulled at any time. Yes, get a gun if you want to protect yourself -- just stay the hell away from me, and I'll take my chances. All I have to worry about here is maybe a stabbing and a gun or two... rather not have to worry about if a fight breaks out a party, some drunk girl decides to pull out her gun because of something her boyfriend did and it turns into some "crime" of passion that takes out half the dance floor along with the guy.
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post #36 of 147
6/17/08 at 1:14pm
^I wished we didn't have to worry about one or the other.....
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post #37 of 147
6/17/08 at 1:17pm
^ Yeah, she had the phone knocked from her hand, and, it's likely the same thing would of happened with a gun if she'd had one (assuming she'd even had time to reach for it.)
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post #38 of 147
6/17/08 at 1:43pm
i would also like to add that if i could i would like to learn the original Krav-Maga.

thats the martial arts of the IDF and they can kill with bare hands. the only reason i haven't gone to learn it is b/c i would be learning the watered down version. still good, but what fun is it if you cant kill someone with your bare hands?!

so that or a gun.

i just would never wish a 19hr rape on even my worst enemies.
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post #39 of 147
6/17/08 at 1:48pm
I hope this guy got butt-raped a lot in the 20 years he spent in jail awaiting the death penalty. He was executed today!Japan executes notorious cannibal killer - Yahoo! News
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post #40 of 147
6/17/08 at 1:49pm
wtf I just realized that the victim DIDNT DIE??
christ... those kinds of scars do not leave a person, the rest of her life is ruined

anyways i live in Canada so the gun debates are different up here. ALthough I will agree, in that situation chances are the gun wouldnt have helped her, especially if it was at home already. And if people carried a gun to write a resume at school, I'd be quite paranoid in class.

what i cant figure out is the mentality behind the attacker. The desire to completely control someone else - where does that come from? Is this attacker just the type who couldnt control such urges? Do we all have them somewhere in our minds, but due to our makeup they are controlled? Maybe supressed?

Hard questions
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post #41 of 147
6/17/08 at 2:05pm
So many of you would shit yourself if you really knew how many random people were packing. The thing is that you don't see it because most are responsible with their firearms and do not act like idiots by brandishing them around in peoples faces.
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post #42 of 147
6/17/08 at 2:12pm
Rape, as it has been explained to me from a mental health standpoint, is far more about power than a sexual release. That is how some prisoners rape others then are released and remain heterosexual. Some people are predisposed to violent, perverted behavior due to chemical imbalances over which they truly have not control. This is why treating these people is so necessary. Others devolop personality disorders due to how they were raised (aka reinforcing bad behavior and not enstilling a sense of right or wrong) or traumatic injuries mental or physical. The mental health profession doesn't do shock therapy and lobotomies anymore but rather treats with medication, and if people take their medication, these disorders can be kept under control. Yeah seriously this girl's life is ruined.
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post #43 of 147
6/17/08 at 2:56pm
Treat them for what? I knew someone would try to explain this away with chemical imbalances and medication. Someone who does this type of thing cannot be treated. They can only be locked up or killed, preferably the latter.
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post #44 of 147
6/17/08 at 3:03pm
my aunt and uncle live in dallas and they both have a cwp.. so they pack and carry and no one would ever know it by looking at them..


I am getting my cwp this summer so that when I drive the 10 hours to my parents house, alone in my car I will feel more safe


Most responsible gun owners know how and when to use a weapon and they arent the ones you have to worry about it... a big part of learning how to shoot and how to store and care for your gun is the bottom line... respect for your weapon.

I have been to the firing range , I know how to shoot, I know how to hold various guns in the correct way, I know what amunition I would choose, I know the kick back I would expect depending on the weapon. Most gun owners that I know took classes and spent a lot of time at the firing range..

And back to the story of the OP.. what a horrific tradgedy for this poor woman to endure.. I am all for pitching in for the very slippery soap to the cell mate named bubba ..
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post #45 of 147
6/17/08 at 3:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JulzIsAuthentic View Post
i would also like to add that if i could i would like to learn the original Krav-Maga.

thats the martial arts of the IDF and they can kill with bare hands. the only reason i haven't gone to learn it is b/c i would be learning the watered down version. still good, but what fun is it if you cant kill someone with your bare hands?!

so that or a gun.

i just would never wish a 19hr rape on even my worst enemies.
Do you watch fight quest too?
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post #46 of 147
6/17/08 at 3:19pm
I'm so sick of hearing about violent crimes against women and children.
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post #47 of 147
6/17/08 at 3:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselsmomma View Post
I'm so sick of hearing about violent crimes against women and children.
I know! This year alone, in the small town where I live, a man set a 19-year-old college student on fire (and killed her), another killed his ex-girlfriend, and yet another was found here on his way to Mexico after he had shot his ex and her 10-month-old baby girl () and kidnapped their son... And that's just what I remember!!!!!
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post #48 of 147
6/17/08 at 4:09pm
Thread Starter 
Don't things like this usually start from poor parenting...I mean come on, you don't just grow up wanting to kill, torture and take advantage of women....

The behaivor has to be learned some where...
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post #49 of 147
6/17/08 at 5:59pm
why do people think that guns are the only way for self defense?? There are other things that can be done/taught. I think that defaulting to guns is a cop out. Learn self defense techniques that are unarmed!
It seems like a lot of these violent encounters happen at close range anyways.
If the typical response to this is 'what if they have a gun' then you will begin to see where pro-legislation people are coming from
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post #50 of 147
6/17/08 at 6:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselsmomma View Post
I'm so sick of hearing about violent crimes against women and children.
Unfortunately that is the price we pay for nonstop information through every imagineable source.
Horrible things have always happened. We hear about every little thing, pretty much whether we like it or not.

Absolutely dreadful story
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