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hmmm creatine?

post #1 of 23
Thread Starter 
looking at the pros and cons of creatine. anybody have any opinions.

here is an article from mayoclinic

Quote:
Creatine

Creatine monohydrate is a compound produced by your body that helps release energy in your muscles. Creatine is a naturally occurring compound, but you also can ingest creatine from protein-rich foods such as meat or fish, or you can take a nutritional supplement. Supplements are available over the counter.
Unlike androstenedione, scientific research indicates that creatine may have some benefit — it can produce small gains in short-term bursts of power.
"Most of the research points to small improvements in short-term power activities like improving maximum-weight bench press or increasing speed during cycling sprints of very short duration," says Edward Laskowski, M.D., a physical medicine and rehabilitation specialist at Mayo Clinic, Rochester, Minn., and co-director of Mayo Clinic's Sports Medicine Center. "Some studies have shown an increase in lean muscle mass with creatine. As a result, there's a lot of press on creatine producing steroid-like results without the side effects."
Creatine helps muscles make and circulate more adenosine triphosphate (ATP). ATP is used for quick, explosive bursts of activity, as in weightlifting or sprinting. Creatine also reduces energy waste products — such as lactic acid — that can cause muscle fatigue. As a result, creatine is purported to enhance performance and decrease fatigue. But there's no evidence that creatine enhances performance in aerobic or endurance sports.
Your liver produces about 2 grams of creatine each day. You can also get creatine from the meat in your diet. Creatine is stored in your muscles, and levels are relatively easily maintained. Because your kidneys remove excess creatine, the value of supplements to someone who already has a high muscle creatine content is questionable.
Possible side effects of creatine that can decrease athletic performance include:
  • Stomach cramps
  • Muscle cramps
  • Nausea
  • Vomiting
  • Diarrhea
Weight gain is a known side effect of creatine — one that is sought after by athletes who want to increase their size. But with prolonged creatine use, weight gain is more likely the result of water retention than an increase in muscle tissue. Water is drawn into your muscle tissue, away from other parts of your body. This puts you at risk of dehydration.
High-dose creatine use may potentially damage your:
  • Kidneys
  • Liver
  • Heart
It's unknown what kind of effect taking creatine has over the long term, especially on teens or younger children. Dosage levels vary widely, depending on which product you use and how much creatine you take.
Since creatine isn't regulated by the FDA, you can't be sure of the purity of creatine supplements you buy on the market. Studies have found varying mixtures of creatine in different creatine products. And some of the inactive ingredients mixed in with the creatine may cause significant side effects, such as allergic reactions.
The bottom line is that the safety of taking creatine is questionable. Most studies involving creatine use examine the performance-enhancing aspects, and side effects are generally not well-reported.
post #2 of 23
Pretty simple really. It's one of the most studied supplements in the pasts 10-15 years. It is a naturally forming substance (you take in a few grams just from eating a steak) and hasn't been shown to produce any harmful side effects except for the very few who get cramps. I've never gotten cramps and it could be alleviated by additional water. Looking at the side effects from WebMD it looks a lot worse than it is. Aside from pure protein, creatine may be the safest supplement you can take. Are you planning on taking some?


*Edit - I just looked at the title of article it's a joke. It's the same as the food pyramid telling us to eat tons of carbs and that fats are bad. Sadly the medical community is waaay behind the times when it comes to supplements.
post #3 of 23
Thread Starter 
edit- article is from mayo rather than webmd
post #4 of 23
interesting....they had my daughter who has a neuromuscular disease on it for a while and we didn't see any positive effects so we took her off it....
post #5 of 23
Interesting...Chris I believe is a user of Creatine for fitness/body building purposes?
post #6 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by MISSPOOKIE View Post
Interesting...Chris I believe is a heavy user of Creatine for fitness/body building purposes?
Yes I am, it is one of the best legal substances out there for strength

I use the kre-alkalyn version which allows for far less to be taken with greater results.

Also no bloating or cramping whatsoever.
post #7 of 23
dave,are you thinking of using creatine,if so for what purpose?

i personally dont like the effects creatine has on me...i lose all my muscularity...i am bigger with it,but look too soft

also,when you cycle off it,you lose the gains you made...and you wasted your money

sure it works if you are an athlete who needs that edge and is after an increase in explosive strength...or if you weight train and need to break through plateaus

it can also cause joint and tendon problems due to drastic increases in strength...your joints and tendons havent had time to readjust to heavy loads...this is what happens alot when taking steroids,which btw are relatively safe if supervised by a doctor...its when you take massive doses that it becomes dangerous
post #8 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteralexia View Post
it can also cause joint and tendon problems due to drastic increases in strength...your joints and tendons havent had time to readjust to heavy loads...this is what happens alot when taking steroids,which btw are relatively safe if supervised by a doctor...its when you take massive doses that it becomes dangerous
Creatine does not equal steroids and the effects of creatine are not as sudden and dramatic as you describe.
post #9 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by mach999 View Post
Creatine does not equal steroids and the effects of creatine are not as sudden and dramatic as you describe.
i didnt say they did
i deal with a hand physio who is alarmed with the ever increasing tendon and joint problems...alot of her patients have been taking creatine
post #10 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteralexia View Post
i didnt say they did
i deal with a hand physio who is alarmed with the ever increasing tendon and joint problems...alot of her patients have been taking creatine
The only way I could see there being any sort of correlation is these people don't know what they're doing and try to lift too much weight thinking creatine is a steroid and acts as such.
post #11 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by mach999 View Post
The only way I could see there being any sort of correlation is these people don't know what they're doing and try to lift too much weight thinking creatine is a steroid and acts as such.
i dont want to be rude,but what part of what i said didnt you understand?

i deal with athletes all the time...i get feedback of what works,what doesnt...what effects certain supplements have

i speak constantly to doctors who deal with athletes

i am also involved in sports biomechanics...i make sure athletes are using right techniques...i also advise alot of bodybuilders...so i think i am in a better position than you to make a qualified statement
post #12 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteralexia View Post
i dont want to be rude,but what part of what i said didnt you understand?

i deal with athletes all the time...i get feedback of what works,what doesnt...what effects certain supplements have

i speak constantly to doctors who deal with athletes

i am also involved in sports biomechanics...i make sure athletes are using right techniques...i also advise alot of bodybuilders...so i think i am in a better position than you to make a qualified statement

You're making the case that creatine causes such a dramatic increase in strength that the tendons and joints can't keep up with the heavy load, correct? I don't see it. Creatine doesn't impact a person that quickly to start lifting enough weight to the point it would have a noticeable effect.

I give up.
post #13 of 23
i know alot of people who train with niggling injuries...taking creatine might increase their stength by 10-15%...that increase is sometimes enough to cause longterm joint and tendon problems...alot of times they just need to take a break

people with a thicker frame and joints will be less likely to have problems as they can withstand heavier loads

i also think you are bringing excess garbage from what happened in the WAYWT thread...
post #14 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteralexia View Post
i know alot of people who train with niggling injuries...taking creatine might increase their stength by 10-15%...that increase is sometimes enough to cause longterm joint and tendon problems...alot of times they just need to take a break

people with a thicker frame and joints will be less likely to have problems as they can withstand heavier loads

i also think you are bringing excess garbage from what happened in the WAYWT thread...
My point is that I think creatine is often blamed for things that could be a result of overtraining.

What happened in WAYWT?
post #15 of 23
do you think you are going to get honest info in muscle mag or other fitness mags...they are owned by supplement companies...literally and by advertising dollars

alot of studies are also funded by supplement companies...unfortunately they dont publish alot of the negative findings in the magazines

they skew the findings to their liking

i didnt want to use this line,as it it makes me sound like a wanker...

but i am sports nutritionists...i know my SHIT...i have read all the studies and deal with athletes/bodybuilders/gym junkies ...in am constantly getting feedback
post #16 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by mach999 View Post
My point is that I think creatine is often blamed for things that could be a result of overtraining.
I have to agree with that statement ( and the statments about the supplement companies and their magazines)

That and alot of these guys who use creatine and then jump off without tapering down, loose the excess water that was lubricating their joints and tendons. They then try and lift exactly what they used to and injure themselves.

And if creatine is used too long, the body shuts down its own production, and also has a harder time processing non powdered creatine ( like the creatine found in abundance in red meat)

So many who use it for extended periods of time without a break, jump off and dont wait for their own levels of creatine to come back to normal before they lift that heavy again.

Many pros dont have a problem, but if you are a newbie, your not developed enough to handle the stress on yor body and you hurt yourself.

Great points by both of you guys, lets not let it get out of hand
post #17 of 23
i think if you eat 6 small meals a day...supplement with protein powder(whey and Micellar),Glutamine,multi vitamin,anti-oxidant,flaxeed oil...you can go broke spending a fortune on supplements...where do you stop...are you going to take supplements in your 50s and 60s?
post #18 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteralexia View Post
i think if you eat 6 small meals a day...supplement with protein powder(whey and Micellar),Glutamine,multi vitamin,anti-oxidant,flaxeed oil...you can go broke spending a fortune on supplements...where do you stop...are you going to take supplements in your 50s and 60s?
I agree, I dont take many supplements

Multivitamins
Creatine
Flax seed oil
Glucosamine
ALA

If you shop around it can be very cheap, there is a seller on ebay that sells pound and kilogram bags of supplements for like 1/10th of what they sell for in stores.
post #19 of 23
purple-K ftw
post #20 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteralexia View Post

but i am sports nutritionists...i know my SHIT...i
you know shit
post #21 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryce View Post
you know shit

sshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...just dont tell anyone...ok
post #22 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteralexia View Post
sshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...just dont tell anyone...ok
Fine.

If you promise to study or at least do a search on Medline before giving biased unscientific advise
post #23 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryce View Post
Fine.

If you promise to study or at least do a search on Medline before giving biased unscientific advise
which part of my bullshit are you questioning?
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