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Ripped Off! And accused of being dishonest!! PICTURES!!

post #1 of 28
Thread Starter 
I recently purchased a pair of Sz 26 Rock and Republic LA Gold crowns from a HF member for USD 140. I was not informed that the jeans are marked IRR and that they were flawed.

When I received the jeans, the tag said that they were slightly IRR. One rivet was spoilt which came off when I tried it on. There was a hole at the back of the jeans and the crowns were placed one slightly higher than the other. When I referred back to the post, I realised that the jeans in the pictures were definitely not the ones sent as the placement of the crowns are totally different!

I took photos of the pair received and told the seller about all the flaws and he actually accused me of being dishonest by taking pictures of another pair!!

Spoilt Rivet:



Tag:


Hole:


Compare the two pictures:
Top:Pair Received
Below: Picture on HF Post




What should I do?
They are obviously different pairs right???
post #2 of 28
Hmmmm...... You can always ask for a partial refund or a full refund because the jeans were not disclosed that they were irregular...You can always say the seller misrepresented the add...Also they seem to be diffrent pictures of diffrent jeans....Hope evrything works out for you....If you need anymore help please ask i am here
post #3 of 28
That sucks. I would ask to have my money back period. That's where some sellers get us. They usually put all sales are final where you can't get your money back when they know something is wrong with them.

I just bought a pair and the rivet was missing. The seller gave me a partial refund because it wasn't mentioned. It was clearly obvious I thought, but I hope to have them fixed soon.
She is a sweetheart.

GET YOUR MONEY BACK
post #4 of 28
Thread Starter 
I requested for a refund and to send the jeans back to him. He agreed but insists that I pay for shipping both ways.

But, I don't see why I should bear a loss in this transaction when he was not honest about the flaws in the first place and is accusing me of being dishonest.

Do you think this is reasonable?
post #5 of 28
The jeans advertised in the pics are obviously not the ones you received. I would ask for a full refund and return the jeans back to the seller. The store tags are still attached so the seller can return them back to C21. (C21 has a 30 day return policy, or a store credit after 30days or a store credit if the receipt is lost) This way no one is out of pocket.
post #6 of 28
Well those are def different pairs. What flaw was listed ?
post #7 of 28
Okay... IMO you should not have to pay for anything in this transaction. I had a pair of irregular jeans sent to me before without being notified and I got ALL my money back (even shipping). You shouldn't have to pay for someone elses mistakes. They know they are selling irregular merchandise so they should disclose everything...
Flip I look over everything top to bottom even when it isn't marked irregular!
post #8 of 28
I'm the seller and this is what happened so far: (please read from bottom and up)


Hi, Jan

Listen, I think I played as nice as I could up to this point.. but if you said it like this, then I guess there won't be a good ending to this.

I accepted your refund request, even though I'm still in doubt that if they ARE indeed the pair of jeans that I sent you, because I'm not the only one who sells these jeans, they are also some other sellers on ebay do sell the same ones; but I tried to put myself in your shoes given that you ARE telling the truth, and that's the only reason I accepted your request for refund.

I have complied every single request that you made so far from the beginning of the whole transaction, including risking my seller's protection on PayPal by shipping them to a suspicious PO Box in California, when your paypal account is actually associated with an address in Singapore.

Anyways, there is no way I'll issue you a partial refund BEFORE you send the jeans back to me. BTW, the "loss" you'll be bearing (the actual shipping cost that will be deducted from the full amount) is $4.55.

Regards,
Andy



Jan Lee <janleeyl@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Andy,

Actually, I don't see why I should bear a loss in this transaction.

I paid for first quality jeans and they were not only slightly IRR and are flawed.

I am not willing to pay for shipping and would like a partial refund before sending the jeans over.

Rgds

Jan

On 04/03/07,

Jan Lee <janleeyl@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Andy,

No problem.

Yes I am aware of that too.

But I really am puzzled at why the crowns in the pictures are lower. I only have the pair that I bought from you and the pictures are of the pair I bought from you.

I asked a tailor whether they could fix the rivets for me but they are not sure that they can do it. I will send the jeans back to you minus the shipping.

Let me know how much the shipping is. Thanks.

Rgds

Jan

On 04/03/07,

Andy Miao <eclipse215@yahoo.com > wrote:

Hi Jan,

Sorry for not getting back to you sooner. I have been very busy for the last couple days..

About the rivet, you said it came off after you tried them on, right? I have no way of knowing it, as I told you that I'm a guy. Therefore, I could only find flaws with my eyes. I have no way of knowing whether it's damaged or not before or after you received them either.

About the placement of the crowns, I'm an honest seller and have sold a lot of jeans both on Ebay and Honest Forum as you can refer to in the feedbacks. I REALLY had only one pair of sz. 26, and they are the jeans from the pics you saw in the post. I don't have to ruin my reputation and all the effort I put into as a seller to make a few bucks out of this pair! It really made me angry that someone would accuse me of shipping out different items from the ones I posted. From the pictures that you sent me, I could see that the crowns are placed higher indeed. If I were to be an dishonest seller, I could have accused you of switching the jeans I sold you with the pair you originally have. It actually happened a lot on ebay transactions.

I understand that as a buyer, you expect to receive a perfect pair of jeans that you paid for, cuz I buy jeans myself sometimes... But you have to understand the frustrations of being a seller as well when this kind of situations happen. I think you would understand if you are a seller yourself.

Anyways, I'll believe that the rivet is already damaged when I sent them, so I'll issue you a refund minus the shipping cost if that sounds reasonable to you. Please send the jeans back to me, and I'll issue a refund through PayPal once I receive them.

Please let me know, thanks.

Andy


Jan Lee <janleeyl@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Andy,

I have attached the pictures I have taken of the jeans.

As you can see, the rivet is bent. It is obvious that it was already like that and not damaged due to transit.

The hole is very tiny and I really don't mind it, but I just thought I'd mention it.

The last 3 pictures I have attached are of the back pockets. Comparing them to the picture on your post(as attached), look at the crowns! They are visibly higher on the pair sent compared to the one you took pictures of.

Just because I have zero feedback does not mean that I am not a responsible buyer! I am sure that you once started with zero too! I would not be kicking up a fuss if I received perfect jeans which I expected to get!

Rgds

Jan

post #9 of 28
Thread Starter 
As you can see, you should have informed me that they are slightly IRR as stated on the tags even if you thought that they were flawless.
No flaws were listed on your post and I expected to receive first quality jeans and thats all.
post #10 of 28
Do you still have the store receipt NBM? If you're concerned that the buyer switched the jeans all you have to do is check the skew number 0424123478155 with your receipt. If it's the same post a picture of it. Is it possible you took a picture of a duplicate pair?
post #11 of 28
the one's you posted and the one labeled 2/3/2007 look the same...but the one after that does look like the crowns are slightly lower
post #12 of 28
Thread Starter 
Also, to clarify that the pictures taken of the jeans received are the actual ones you sent, I can take another picture inclusive of the tags(a clearer one). To show you specifically that you sent the pair. If I am taking pictures of another pair that I have, how would you explain the fact that the jeans in the pictures have in fact the same tags as the ones you once had? Could it be so coincidental that I kept a pair hoping that I received another with the exact same words on the tag(AND SERIAL NO)?
post #13 of 28
agreee also do not issue any refund imo til jeans are in hand. That is proper way to do it
post #14 of 28
This is getting confusing> nbm you have only sold on pair of these exact jeans?
post #15 of 28
Thread Starter 
NBM had two gold crowns for sale, one Sz 26 and one Sz 27. I purchased the Sz 26. Look at the posts, he used the same first three pictures for both posts. Maybe that is why the jeans I received are different from the ones in the pictures.

http://www.honestforum.com/womens-sz...z-27-rare.html
http://www.honestforum.com/womens-sz...z-26-sold.html
post #16 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by izzy613 View Post
Do you still have the store receipt NBM? If you're concerned that the buyer switched the jeans all you have to do is check the skew number 0424123478155 with your receipt. If it's the same post a picture of it. Is it possible you took a picture of a duplicate pair?
Hi izzy, you bought jeans from C21 before too, and you should know that one seiral number doesn't only associated one specific pair of jeans! The jeans have exact the same serial number if they are the same styles even in different sizes! Not only that, I have ever bought different colors of crowns in the same sizes that had the same exact serial number! I am sure if you check those receipts, you will find out! But that's not the point, I actually didn't even say anything about her possibly switched the jeans until she accused me of selling her a different pair. So at that point, I got angry and replied her saying I could also assume her a dishonest buyer who switched the jeans. I chose to believe her, that's why I agreed on the refund because I acknowledge that it was my mistake not to mention the tag said slightly irregular although I didn't find any flaw before sending them out! I think the only flaw that I could have found if being much more thoroughly inspecting the jeans would be the small hole around the pocket! The rivet only came off after she tried on the jeans!

Anyway, now she is even asking for the partial refund before sending out the jeans back to me - that I just can't agree on!
post #17 of 28
Regardless, if the jeans are marked irregular that absolutely should be disclosed. And if those were the tags you had then it should have been obvious that they're irregulars. But, no one ever gets a refund before sending the merchandise back. I think it's unreasonable for the buyer to request money back before returning the jeans. But definately, a refund is due int his case.
post #18 of 28
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ttramell View Post
agreee also do not issue any refund imo til jeans are in hand. That is proper way to do it
Ok, I accept that NBM should refund me only after he has received the jeans. But who should incur the costs of shipping both ways??
post #19 of 28
As a frequent seller, I have made honest mistakes before (e.g. overlooking a hole or something like that) and I incur all the shipping costs.

If the buyer decided that he/she wanted to return an item just because it didn't fit or something like that, THEN the buyer would be responsible for paying all shipping costs.

In this case, I think that NBM should be responsible for the shipping costs both ways
post #20 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by NBM View Post
Hi izzy, you bought jeans from C21 before too, and you should know that one seiral number doesn't only associated one specific pair of jeans! The jeans have exact the same serial number if they are the same styles even in different sizes! Not only that, I have ever bought different colors of crowns in the same sizes that had the same exact serial number! I am sure if you check those receipts, you will find out! But that's not the point, I actually didn't even say anything about her possibly switched the jeans until she accused me of selling her a different pair. So at that point, I got angry and replied her saying I could also assume her a dishonest buyer who switched the jeans. I chose to believe her, that's why I agreed on the refund because I acknowledge that it was my mistake not to mention the tag said slightly irregular although I didn't find any flaw before sending them out! I think the only flaw that I could have found if being much more thoroughly inspecting the jeans would be the small hole around the pocket! The rivet only came off after she tried on the jeans!

Anyway, now she is even asking for the partial refund before sending out the jeans back to me - that I just can't agree on!
I do not think that it is her fault that the rivet came off after she tried on the jeans. The rivet must have been faulty to begin with for it to have fallen off! I do not think that the rivet would fall off if it was in perfect condition, if not all the rivets on my R&Rs would have fallen off by now!
post #21 of 28
IMO NBM should pay for shipping both ways, but refund should only be issued after he has the jeans.
post #22 of 28
I paid 180 for my alpha gold sigs and when i tried them on, the rivet popped off :\ i said oh well cause it's not the person who was selling them's fault
post #23 of 28
Ok, so the jeans you received were from another picture in size 27. I can understand that NBM took only one set of picture of the same style, it can be really time consuming when you have multiple pairs of the same style and wash and size to take detailed pictures of each. It was an honest mistake that the flaws were missed, however it is still a mistake so the seller should refund the full amount including shipping fees once the jeans are returned.
I'm also a frequent seller and if I make a mistake I always refund the full amount and eat the shipping costs. The buyer should not be out of pocket for an oversight by the seller.
post #24 of 28
In the past I have sold jeans in the same wash and size. As an honest seller, I feel it is the seller's responsibility to take pic's of each individual pair. I know as a buyer I want to see exactly what I'm purchasing, and I feel it's only fair to to extend the same courtesy to other buyers as well.

As for the rivet falling off- well, that could happen to anyone, right? If I were the seller in the situation, I would offer a full refund if the buyer didn't want to keep them and if they wanted to keep them, a partial refund to cover the cost of fixing them and just as a courtesy.

As for the hole- sure, I've missed details as well when I'm selling something. We're all human, we make mistakes! I would treat this exactly the same way as I'd treat the rivet. Full refund or a partial depending on the buyer's preference.

As for the shipping... well, that does suck, I totally agree. BUT. To be a good seller means that you must make your customer happy. I would pay for shipping both ways.

NBM. If you have the pictures of the jeans that you sold Jan, why can't you see the hole in them? I am a little confused about that. Or is it just so small that it's hidden? I'm just confused is all, not trying to be confrontational or rude.
post #25 of 28
as for crowns, ive seen numerous 1st quality ones that are slightly uneven, either tilted up/down left/right. If this was the only case then I wouldnt refund unless theyre extremely crooked.

however the holes and stuff is bad. should be dealt with.
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