8X2 initially is very tight but stretches nicely to your body after few times, so they do run 1/2 size small. With 811P they are loose in the waist and tight from the knee down + the denim is crisp when you feel them. 801C is slightly similar to 811P little bit crisp on the hand feel. I got my normal size in 801C in the waist they are ok but from knee down they more roomier compare to my other Thavar's if that make sense. so if you want nice tight fit you can size down one.