How's color of 823z compare with 827k & 827q? I'm thinking about that one too.
I have to size up to 31w for 827k since 30w was sold out on cultizm. But because of thicker denim, its just as good as 827q and 886z.
All jeans stretches whether its 100% cotton or cotton/elastane combo. The ones with elastane will keep its shape longer though. But at the end they all do.what I have experienced is the ones with thicker denim/weight don't stretch as much as the lighter ones.
I also try to size down on some and ending up with uncomfortable thigh. So I just get my regular size, wear a belt when waist gets loose. At least my thigh doesn't look like a sausage.